Curse

MithranArkanere · Jun 07, 2011, 12:27 AM // 00:27

This suggestion basically adds a way to troll the entire community by allowing something like forcing everyone to go around with only healing spells.

As much as I like those funny Trollface meme jokes, I don't think anyone would be happy with that, not even in April's Fools.

lursey · Jun 07, 2011, 03:18 AM // 03:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine

How in the name of everything that is sane is your idea better than the current situation? What you would create is a situation where the current HoH holder would make a build they are most likely the best at at running, thus annihilating any chance of an opposing party to win.

I'm gonna make an analogy here, so I can try to get through that thick, very, very thick mind of yours.

Let's say you have a real life situation where you have small competitions with each other. The one who wins the most is obviously the current winner and holder. Let's say you have a professional athlete, a professional armwrestler, and a professional spear thrower. The competition starts with 3 random things, let's say chess, because there used to be a chess player involved, but he decided to go do something else. The armwrestler wins from both the spear thrower and the athlete and thus becomes the winner. He can now choose what match the others have to play to win. Guess what he's gonna choose: that what he's best in: armwrestling. The other 2 guys will never be able to win until he decides that he's bored and has farmed enough fame in Halls to peace out. Then the Spearthrower who has a better arm than the athlete might win, and of course is gonna choose spear throwing.. Are you seeing the problem here? Your system is so easily abused that it's ridiculous.

Also, ever heard of artistic freedom?

How can you not understand that having a better build than someone else is the entire god damn point of PvP??? Are you really that stupid or are you just pretending?? Cause this is really beyond me..

it is unbelievable that the objectives of HA are being constantly forgotten or missed out, which they mainly are to kill, with sometimes, relics, capture, holding.

the example you've given in this case to win in hoh, is to show how well you can press the button of a shooting gun towards a chess player to kill... as you can see there is no common ground for the chess player to kill faster than how you press the shooting gun

in my example, you said a player will choose their best ability to win and keep winning, no other players with such ability can best out the best, if it is the best who act according to the objectives with the same common ground, that he is best at chess to kill another chess player, then wouldn't it supposed to be a case of fairness

for a change of stage to best of shooting gun, you have to first best at playing chess, or let some other best chess player to help you to change a stage....

then more of different stages for different ability players to have a common ground acting according to the HA map objectives to show their skills can finally be occurred, which it supposed to be like that... having the same common ground....I think this is what suppose to be a fair chance of artistic freedom...according to your simple artistic freedom idea....there is not really a fair chance in the current situation.

it wouldn't be any fair if you want to use a chess player to win a gun shooter in a death-match killing game unless it is a chess player vs a chess player.

a gun shooter is always a better build than a chess player build to kill....but so what, it is only the gun, there is absolutely no players skill can be represented.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lemming

This whole talk of "supporting" leads me to believe that you don't think that organized groups win halls 95% of the time.

there is no matter whether organized groups will be greatly affected in my suggestion, because if it is an organized groups, then they will still be 95% of the time having the monopoly of builds, which is the same with current ha. the best build will occur the most and stay the longest.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

This suggestion basically adds a way to troll the entire community by allowing something like forcing everyone to go around with only healing spells.

As much as I like those funny Trollface meme jokes, I don't think anyone would be happy with that, not even in April's Fools.

this is the fair chance of artistic freedom as it has been suggested, the one who is best at using the healing spells on the stage according to the map objectives wins the hoh.

and patience is one of the most important factor needs to be trained when using healing spell..

it is much easier to regulate, if you do not want a specific stage with a common ground occurring.

vitorvdp_68 · Jun 07, 2011, 06:32 AM // 06:32

I'm not sure you understand what the word freedom means. Freedom =/= one team getting to choose the build to be used. Freedom = any team being able to run whatever build they want.

And no one here said this would be a fair chance of artistic freedom, you are misreading posts.

lursey · Jun 07, 2011, 10:02 AM // 10:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by vitorvdp_68

I'm not sure you understand what the word freedom means. Freedom =/= one team getting to choose the build to be used. Freedom = any team being able to run whatever build they want.

And no one here said this would be a fair chance of artistic freedom, you are misreading posts.

so you want freedom, but not anyone can have such a freedom, how is that not contradicting your own argument?

Bright Star Shine · Jun 07, 2011, 10:03 AM // 10:03

Just the fact that you keep denying that high-end PvP is based around having the best team build that has the best spikes yet the best defense at the same time is ridiculous. How can you not see that the entire concept is not player skill, but the entire teams skill to play together and how you would kill the entire concept of being better at making a build with your godawful idea??

There is nothing keeping people out of HA that is related to builds. It's not that people say "I don't wanna HA because I don't wanna spend time making a build" and if you DO say that you don't belong in HA anyway. It's people saying "I don't wanna spend my time getting past the initial learning curve and actually improve as a player, I just want easy wins and fame cause I'm a lazy ass bastard".

Quote:

Originally Posted by lursey

so you want freedom, but not anyone can have such a freedom, how is that not contradicting your own argument?

How is forcing people to run a build they don't want to run freedom? HURR f***ing DURR...

lursey · Jun 07, 2011, 10:28 AM // 10:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine

Just the fact that you keep denying that high-end PvP is based around having the best team build that has the best spikes yet the best defense at the same time is ridiculous. How can you not see that the entire concept is not player skill, but the entire teams skill to play together and how you would kill the entire concept of being better at making a build with your godawful idea??

There is nothing keeping people out of HA that is related to builds. It's not that people say "I don't wanna HA because I don't wanna spend time making a build" and if you DO say that you don't belong in HA anyway. It's people saying "I don't wanna spend my time getting past the initial learning curve and actually improve as a player, I just want easy wins and fame cause I'm a lazy ass bastard".

How is forcing people to run a build they don't want to run freedom? HURR f***ing DURR...

I think many people misunderstood, only build works, we called it 1 working 8 sets of builds, not 8 builds forming into 1.

which one are you arguing on?

who makes that 1 build?, 1 person or 8 persons?...if it is not 8 persons making their own bar and forming a build, then there is no such thing called of artistic freedom as you mention...and if you say 8 persons making their own build will work in current ha, then it basically is in your dream, perhaps it will work but only at the stage of fighting NPC.

a working build only when 8 person come into a single mind of a set of 8 skill bars...when it requires come into a single mind...then it is not artistic freedom for players, as there are constraints.

no one is forcing any people to run any build if they don't want to, they can opt out, it is their freedom to choose not to run the build, how is it different from now?

running other build so that you can finally run your own build, is not forcing other people running your build, it is basically making a barrier for other people before they can run their own build, they can still make and use their own build, only when they are skillful enough and win hoh...which it isn't different from what is happening now, that is

1) get supports from whoever want to join your build.
2) the builds have to works against other builds and maps.
3) be skillful.

however what my suggestion does, is to put skills before build, not builds before skill..

1 build or 8 players skill, which one is more important, I will say 8 players skill should be of more important in pvp. a build is a dead code, only it alive when there are players control it.

if you want to have build wars, you should let AI to control your build, not players, if players control a build, then it is pvp not build wars.

vitorvdp_68 · Jun 07, 2011, 10:30 AM // 10:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bright Star Shine

How is forcing people to run a build they don't want to run freedom? HURR f***ing DURR...

There's no reasonable answer for this question, and as such the discussion will just keep going in circles.

Current situation = choose whatever build you want = freedom

Proposed situation = decide to play fixed build = everyone playing the same build = boring format is boring

or

decide not to play (most probable outcome) = less players = dead format is dead

I guess we could say...
/thread

Quote:

Originally Posted by lursey

running other build so that you can finally run your own build, is not forcing other people running your build, it is basically making a barrier for other people before they can run their own build, they can still make and use their own build, only when they are skillful enough and win hoh...which it doesn't different from what is happening now, that is

Has anyone really been far as decided to use even go want to do look more like?

lursey · Jun 07, 2011, 10:32 AM // 10:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by vitorvdp_68

There's no reasonable answer for this question, and as such the discussion will just keep going in circles.

Current situation = choose whatever build you want = freedom

Proposed situation = decide to play fixed build = everyone playing the same build = boring format is boring

or

decide not to play (most probable outcome) = less players = dead format is dead

I guess we could say...
/thread

the build is not fixed, it will get change into other once there is winner in hoh, opt out = dead of that build, not dead of hoh